Criticism on Pottersues: A Harsh Reality or Just Plain Mean - Comments

I, too, am "guilty as charged." I was listening to a band whose music I utilized to write a songfic back in 2006 and so, feeling nostalgic, I went back to go look at the fic (Ginny Weasley: Supervixen). Surprisingly, I had a number of more recent reviews- including one that directed me to the "pottersues" site. It took me a while to find the specific entry pertaining to my fanfic (10-7-09), but when I did, I had a few laughs. The fact that PotterSue got nearly 100 people to read my fic proved that even "bad" publicity has its positive effects.
What some of the "blasters" failed to recognize was that this was a songfic written just for fun when I couldn't get a particular band out of my head (maybe because fanfiction.net does not allow you to post song lyrics?). The whole point of Supervixen was to write a dystopic (that is, really REALLY freaking unrealistically unhappy!) version of events if Harry died and make a "badass" Ginny somewhat akin to Lara Croft: Tombraider or Sailor Moon. The wardrobe choices were purposely ridiculous so as to be akin to the "sexy outfits" that boys so adore on their comic book characters and movie heroines/bond girls. Ginny's modified "character" was snarky and sarcastic, and most of all GRIEVING for Harry's death- in her own twisted, denial-soaked way. Apparently, the readers of PotterSue failed to read between the lines in that regard. In addition, the Ginny "lookalike" contest was a spoof/nod at Charlie Chaplin- who did not win his own lookalike contest.
Point being- Supervixen was just for fun. It was a creative writing exercise that I enjoyed, and apparently many fans did, too. If it provided the bloggers on PotterSue some entertainment (even if only bashing), then that's no skin off my back.
To the blogger's credit-- she did actually REMOVE some comments that were directed towards me personally (the "Suethor" as the authors are called). Personally, I would have liked to have read them, but I can see how this might be VERY damaging to others, so in all, I am grateful to her if she does this to ALL her posts.
To the blogger's discredit- she admitted that she quit reading after chapter 2, which describes a new Draco character development (he is a pederast- a result of his lack of relationship with his father in this AU fic). She apparently was too disgusted to continue, which I took actually as a compliment. That chapter was SUPPOSED to disturb you- apparently, mission: accomplished.
But I digress- if PotterSue is going to attempt to reign in her minions and get them to provide only constructive criticism, it will be a long time coming. Constructive Criticism is NOT slander/libel, which I can see how some authors might feel is what the site promotes. Maybe I'm strange, but I just got a good laugh. What the bloggers didn't realize is that my fic was just that- FICTION, and for FUN. The outrageous things I did were completely on purpose, and if readers couldn't read between the lines to see the underlying themes, then that isn't my fault- that is their English teacher's. It was JK's sandbox, I was just playing with her toys and using my slightly overactive imagination.
If the site actually does help some writers to improve, then this is great! Some inexperienced authors pen (type) Mary Sues because they don't realize what they are doing. Then there are those that write them on purpose just for fun and because they just enjoy writing!
Either way-- if the site gets people to keep writing and improve, then GREAT!! If it turns into cyber-bullying, then by all means, it should be shut down. Kids have enough to deal with these days. Pottersue will *hopefully* be aware of the potential responsibility she has and make sure to keep her bloggers in check and refrain from anything too hurtful directed at the author personally. This day in age- you never know what will cause a lawsuit.
Lighten up, everybody! Fiction is supposed to be for FUN. If you're writing fanfiction, it will help you to be an even better writer when and if you do make your own original material- and isn't that what it's all about?

"The posts however, are far from being filled with constructive criticism, but hateful truths."

Not really. There's only very nasty stuff if the story's a toxic or REALLY REALLY bad (We're talking Snermione level.) Otherwise it's maybe a little mean, but nothing hateful.

"The FAQ even has a question stating "Why is my story here?" with the answer "Because it sucks.""

Don't blame the current person who runs Pottersues for that. The FAQs were written in 2003-2005, before the new person started doing Pottersues (2007). The new owner actually deletes comments that cross the line and/or insult the person who wrote the story--Hate the sue, not the suethor.


"Instead the reviews, even though filled with pointed-out flaws, come off as harsh and flaming."

If you are talking about the reviews people actually tell the suethors, they're not flames. They're constructive. The comments are sort of a place to get all that pent-up "WTF is this?" out, then the members will go review constructively.

"These reviews can kill the souls of many new writers."

I think "kill the souls" is a little dramatic... Perhaps "injure the egos temporarily"?

"When these authors find their stories on the blog, they fall apart and start doubting other every little word they ever wrote."

I thought that was a stage everyone goes through. You hit a certain point, realize your stories need work, and go fix them. It might be triggered by Pottersues (mine was indirect after realizing my stories were very similar to those posted) but all the young writers I know go through this stage repeatedly.

And finally, I always review constructively, even when I know the author won't listen. And I know so many people who do the same. So not all the Pottersues minions are mean and flame-happy.

@Insanity's Artist: Links to (and excerpts of) stories are posted by other people, not the authors.

I myself was a member of this group and frequent commenter there for a couple years, and I agree that the overall mentality there is not helpful or constructive. There is more of an emphasis--by both the blog owner and many commenters--on being snarky over being helpful or empathetic, on how well you can put that stupid Mary-Sue writer in their place. I'm ashamed to say that I enjoyed it, and participated in it for a while.

Then I didn't participate in the site for a while...when I went back to check the place out after a few years, I found the whole thing gruesome and indicative of a mob mentality. I guess I'd grown up a bit too much and experienced too much in the intervening years to be able to enjoy participating or even reading.

I agree with those who state that being able to take criticism is an integral part of being a writer, but I also feel that some are equating constructive criticism with outright bullying and flaming (which, as I've stated, is the emphasis of the blog). There are plenty of helpful webpages (and individual critics) that explain Mary Sue-ism and how not to perpetrate it, that manage to get their point across without lowering themselves to the level of Pottersues. To essentially say "this is the only/best way of countering Mary Sue-ism" is, at the very least, sheer laziness.

Part of the problem may be that people who are less articulate/patient/mature (the traits often go together) still want to have their say on these stories, rather than take time to be diplomatic or leave the job to others more qualified (that is, more willing to do the 'heavy lifting' by making an effort to be tactful).

And I agree with those concerned about the chilling effect that outright hostility has on budding young writers--this is rationalized by the members with "well a lot of us wrote Mary Sues too and I'm glad someone told me off"--a twisted sort of "someone bullied me, so now I get to bully other people". Like I've said above, I'm ashamed to have taken part for as long as I did.

Unfortunately, many there seem to feel that their right to express themselves in whatever manner is automatically more important than the feelings of other human beings.

Do people post their stories on there themselves or does someone else?

It is mean, and I'm not going to bother justifying what the person behind the page did, but the person did state that there was a reason it went up as a blog and not as reviews. It's not nice to do that, of course, but the person behind it made it very clear what kind of site it is, and if a person doesn't like it, they don't have to see it.

I personally found it quite comical, but I did feel guilty. When I first started out, I had Mary-Sues all over the place, and that's okay at first, but I grew out of it. Harsh criticism hurt, but sometimes that's what a person needs. That's what I need. But there is a fine line between insulting and being harsh, and I do feel that person is crossing that line. While it's good for a bit of a cheap shot to LOLing at the expense of the suethor, it does leave a bit of a bitter taste in one's mouth.

It's the internet, and quite honestly, I've seen worse. I've written worse on sites that were notoriously known for being horrific ([i]My Immortal[/i], anyone? A person wrote a fic similar to it and I flamed the hell out of it, and not on a blog, but directly as a review. Shamefully, I admit it, but I did it. I'm not saying we all do, but a lot of us do that.) and well, that's what happens.

The fact of the matter is, while it's crude and awfully mean, it's there and there's nothing we can do about it.

My answer to that would be 'Alright, let's see [i]your[/i] story.' And, as the FAQ so charmingly states, they purposefully make sure that doesn't happen. Thus, I don't find it particularily daring of this individual.
I can sorta kinda see the merit of this if it was voluntary. Like, if the author is willingly subjecting themselves to the flaming, because then...well, it's their problem if they end up offended because they wanted the criticism. And some of the reviews are semi nice.
I don't like how it's without the author's consent, though.

First off, if the authors are using Mary Sues and Gary Stu's then they need criticism to improve.

Second, I agree that the truth is better and you shouldn't have to fluff it up. However, the way that blog runs is Hateful. Like the FAQ, instead of the answer to "Why is my story here?" being "Because it sucks" it should read something like "Because it could you a lot of improvement."

Being rude and saying it sucks is bringing the writer down. I think the guy that runs it should focus more on harsh critiquing instead of writing down a laughable review.

As both a writer and a reader, I find those comments patently offensive and have no value critique-wise. I can only imagine if my story popped up on that site and everyone read those hateful things. There is a pretty clear line between criticism and flaming and Pottersue has crossed it.

@BlueSunRise, Getting an "Update more" comment has nothing to do with whether or not your writing was good or bad. Sometimes people just don't know what to say. Or are too lazy to say more than that.

Plus, there's a huge difference between flaming and actual criticism from someone who doesn't like your work. That's the problem.

That site, is hilarious. I actually wanna thank you for showing me it.

I do get that what the person is doing is offensive, but seriously, its one bad review and not everyone is going to like what you write and if you cant deal with it then... well, then learn to deal with it cause thats life for you. Not everyone will like what you do or write.

Plus, honestly, the writers, they should be posting their story online because they want to be better writers and the only way to do that is if you get criticism. Just complaining cause you get something other than a "update more!" or "this so amazing update!" is bratty, those writers should just go back and really fix their work. Honestly I think that website helps writers more than hurts them.

Just took a look at the site. Ugh. I was literally disgusted by skimming through the FAQ's section. The [i]This is my journal and I can mock what I want.[/i] quote really pissed me off. What a terrible attitude that person has.

I disagree with the site "flaming" authors, if that's what a majority of them do. I find that totally unacceptable. I mean, something like that wouldn't even be allowed on Mibba because you'd definitely get a warning or a banning for flaming another user. I don't see flaming as being constructive or telling the truth. At all. It's just plain rude. Especially since giving constructive criticism is not difficult to do.

The fact that they target writers by calling them terrible is just really going to put a lot of people off writing what they like just because of a small number of people making fun of them.

Aside from a couple of spelling mistakes and punctuation errors, this was a good article. I enjoyed reading it.

[i]What Pottersues doing is very brave as many would not have the courage to tell the truth. [/i]

I disagree greatly with this statement. It's not brave to publicly humiliate someone with the intention of giving others a good laugh. It's easy to be “brave” when you have a bunch of followers backing you up. Think about it, the person(s) who run the site do so because they get more praise for it than trouble. Do you think they'd still be running the site if the feedback they received was more negative than positive? I sincerely doubt it.

It's easy to make fun of someone in a public forum such as that because you'll never have to deal with them one-on-one, and when you know that most of the people watching will side with you. It's much more difficult to slam someone to their face privately, in a place were you'd be held accountable for what you say and have to defend your actions by yourself. People like this aren't brave at all. They're attention seeking and they're cowards. People like this only put people down to build themselves up. If they really wanted to help out these writers, they'd contact them privately or at least through the commenting system of wherever they story is original hosted, and offer actually constructive criticism.

Stuff like this makes me sick. This is not how you “help” anyone. The people who create blogs like these aren't writers.