Is God Real?

  • January Rose

    January Rose (100)

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    I believe a God exists. To me, it is the only thing that makes sense. How did the world start? How did humans get here?
    October 24th, 2014 at 09:45pm
  • CallusedSilk

    CallusedSilk (100)

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    I don't believe in God, but if he exists, especially if we're going by the bible, then he's the cruelest, most ruthless, sadistic monster this world has ever known.
    October 25th, 2014 at 05:39pm
  • Collin Berend

    Collin Berend (230)

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    This is greatly a tricky question. Even as an atheist I would say, no one knows. Rather look at the probability of said deity being real. For one, which God? If you compare all gods and a view of no god, this includes all possible ways of life being how it is and the universe via no deity help and through natural course.

    Then you should consider the probability of God X vs all possible variables.

    Does God (Assuming you speak of the god of Abraham) exist? No one knows and it is that simple. You could argue, there is no evidence there for no god as you might with things like fairy tales. That is up to the individual.

    My view, I say no. Not with certainty of course, no one really can in my view. However, when people ask me things like: "How did the world start?" I tel them what I know or the scientific models. Anything more I say that I do not know. Not knowing is not a reason to believe in something just to say you have an answer to it.
    October 30th, 2014 at 02:55am
  • MythicalMassacre

    MythicalMassacre (100)

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    Last night, me and three people got on this guys behind on Facebook because he's Christian and believes in God, but trying to get everyone believe in God with him. When it comes to believing in something, I tend to find proof before anything, I don't wanna say I'm an atheist, but more Agnostic, you ask everyone if God is real & a lot of people get mad when certain people say NO. Their belief is their own, if there is a God we will meet him at the gates up above. Until than, who knows?
    November 4th, 2014 at 06:11pm
  • MythicalMassacre

    MythicalMassacre (100)

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    @ CallusedSilk
    Yes you're certainly right, more people chose Satan's side as he didn't kill as many people as God has in his life time. He's more cruel than anyone.
    November 4th, 2014 at 06:12pm
  • January Rose

    January Rose (100)

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    @ CallusedSilk

    @ P00kieBearGh0st

    Just out of curiousity, what made you think that? Like, what you believe God is a sick, cruel person?
    November 7th, 2014 at 05:42am
  • CallusedSilk

    CallusedSilk (100)

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    @ January Rose
    The bible did. Like how it's somehow considered a sweet story that he drowned the entire planet except for one family and 2 of every 'unclean' creature (7 of every 'clean' creature), only to then 'apologize' for that shit with a fucking rainbow. Or how in one instance, kids mocked a man for being bald, and so God sent a bear (or two bears depending on the translation) that mauled 42 children to death (2 Kings 2:23-25) or how Lot's wife got turned to salt just for making the mistake of glancing behind her. Oh and with Sodom and Gomorrah, the place was destroyed because of bad manners essentially since they wanted to know the angel, yet somehow this gets turned into 'rape', or how people ignore the fact that Lot flat out offers his two daughters up to be gang raped (Genesis 19:8), yet Lot's supposed to be a good man? Or how it's one of his rules that if a virgin is raped, she has to marry her rapist and they're not allowed to get divorced (Deuteronomy 22:29).

    At least a couple verses where baby killing is just straight up approved of (Hosea 13:16 and Psalm 137:9). Judges 21:10-24 talks about how it's okay to murder everyone except for virgins, whom would be dragged off, raped and forced to marry them. Oh and 'cause people love the story of God freeing the Israelites from Egypt? Well, then let's not forget how he purposely murdered Egyptian first-born children even though it wasn't necessary since the pharaoh probably would have released them after the sixth plague but God hardened his heart so he wouldn't (Exodus 9:12).

    Honestly, that's just the tip of the iceberg when it comes to just reasons from the bible for as to why God is at best, useless, and at worst, evil. These are all things I could remember in about 5 minutes. Reading the bible is the reason I'm no longer Christian, because I can not, with good conscience, follow, worship or admire a creature so abhorrent as the Judeo-Christian god.
    November 7th, 2014 at 06:40am
  • January Rose

    January Rose (100)

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    @ CallusedSilk
    Ok. Those are really good examples of how you think God is a cruel person. And I'm not going to try and take that way from you. But what about all the positive examples in the Bible? Like, creating the 10 Commandments, rules everyone should follow to be a better person. Or promising everyone who believes in him will go to Heaven and live eternally? Or sending his son to pay the price so that no one has to go to hell?
    I don't know why God did all those things, and the only person who can answer that is him.
    November 7th, 2014 at 04:03pm
  • CallusedSilk

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    @ January Rose
    The 10 commandments aren't good examples since God had a chance to make good rules and then used the first 3 of them for his own selfish pride, despite the fact that he's supposed to be without sin. Promising everyone who believes in him going to Heaven is also not actually all that sweet when you consider the fact that he's the only reason Hell exists, and the fact that 'believing in him' doesn't exactly stop bad people from getting into heaven or stop good people from going to Hell.
    November 7th, 2014 at 04:36pm
  • wxyz

    wxyz (240)

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    January Rose:
    But what about all the positive examples in the Bible? Like, creating the 10 Commandments, rules everyone should follow to be a better person.
    1) Thou shalt have no other gods before me
    2) Thou shalt not make unto thee any graven image

    These don't really have anything to do with being a better person at all, they're just about prostrating yourself before God (and only God) because... well, there isn't really a because, apparently.

    3) Thou shalt not take the name of the Lord thy God in vain

    Again, this doesn't really seem to have much to do with being a better person, and in fact no one's really ever been able to come up with a watertight definition of what it even entails.

    4) Remember the sabbath day, to keep it holy

    Again, just pleasing God and no one else, this one. And I haven't seen any evidence of anyone having been punished for working on Saturday (yes, Saturday), or even Sunday, if we go by what everyone has seemed to think the Sabbath is now.

    5) Honour thy father and thy mother

    This is actually the first moral teaching from a purely human perspective, but even then it's rather vague and doesn't acknowledge that not all parents ought necessarily to be honoured.

    6) Thou shalt not kill

    Fair enough.

    7) Thou shalt not commit adultery

    If this refers specifically to cheating on one's spouse, fair enough. If it refers to other things such as promiscuity, non-reproductive sex, or even lusting after someone, then there are questions.

    8) Thou shalt not steal

    Fair enough.

    9) Thou shalt not bear false witness against thy neighbour

    Okay, but always? Is it always wrong to lie? I wouldn't say so. The same thing applies to this as it does to number 5, I think.

    10) Thou shalt not covet

    Seeing as this is referring to property and women (which the writers of the Bible could have more succinctly referred to as simply "property"), this one is rather superfluous as 7 and 8 are actually enough to bear in mind when considering other people's wives, houses or cattle. Coveting is simply wanting, which is a distinctly innate phenomenon, so to discourage someone from that seems rather pointless. Not to mention the sexism that is obvious from this particular commandment.

    Really, only two of the ten constitute good all-round moral teachings, and personally I'm sceptical of the idea that people wouldn't have been able to figure out that killing and stealing were wrong without God needing to them.
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    Or promising everyone who believes in him will go to Heaven and live eternally?
    What about all the people who are born into societies where believing in (the Christian) God is nigh on impossible (assuming they don't emigrate to a country wherein Christianity is adhered to) due to either having no choice but to believe in (e.g.) Islam or Hinduism, or simply living in a society such as a small tribe where none of the main theistic religions are even known about?
    November 21st, 2014 at 11:05am
  • Teddi Manni

    Teddi Manni (100)

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    @ CallusedSilk

    I completely agree that a God who does that is a cruel one.

    However, the Bible is a translation. It wasn't not originally English. The children weren't literally children. That got lost in translation because the Bible was originally Hebrew and in the Bible it said that the ones who mocked the man were "na'ar" which is a term meaning a person anywhere up to 40 years of age.

    And God told Lot's wife not to look back and to keep moving forward, telling her she would be a goner if she looked back. She didn't care and looked back anyway.

    But enough of that. I would like to just say that by letting people go completely unpunished (in the Bible there are reasons for every time God has asked his people to attack a place or whatever and it was always because they were wicked. If you are a wicked person, why should they not be punished? That makes no sense at all.) We are letting people do whatever the heck they please.

    That is the sad thing about today's society: we are so "open minded" and "accepting of everything" that we make each other into objects, murder each other, steal, hate one another, sexualize everyone, all without consequence. Because that's what today's world is: free of judgment and punishment (I'm aware there are people who judge others. Happens all the time. I more meant that we don't judge sin and things that tear up the soul, instead, we accept them as "okay" and as a "characteristic of who we are" I should be able to express who I am and be who I want to be. Why would someone want to be wicked, tearing up the spirit living inside them?) Also, punishment as in those who do wrong, they just go to a jail where they don't have to do much and they get free food and stuff--Jail isn't great, but it isn't the end of the world to be there either...especially if you only have only a few years in there.)

    But to get to the main, overall point that might sum up what you see as cruel and awful: why should we disobey God? (which is why those people were killed) He is the one who made us, after all. He gave us life. If it weren't for Him, we wouldn't be here or have the life we have. It seems arrogant to hate and disobey the hand that gave you your life. Then to not be punished for it only encourages everyone to continue to disobey. Whether we are six or ninety-nine years old, our brains and wisdom do not compare to how Wise God is. We are children. So, if we aren't punished for something, we continue to do it. Even punished, however, people still do awful things...it proves how childish is arrogant all of us really are.

    I know I won't change your opinion at all, but I felt the need to make a counter at what you say; I promise, I am not hating :) I love you and admire your reasoning of your opinions instead of bashing people <3

    @ Alex; periphery.
    Why should we not follow those commandments? God is the one who made us, after all. He gave us life. If it weren't for Him, we wouldn't be here or have the life we have. It seems arrogant to lash and disobey the hand that gave you your life.

    Yes, it seems arrogant He would request us to not follow other gods, but HE made us. No one else.

    (It doesn't matter whether you believe in God or not, I was just looking at the Bible as a whole since that's where you got the commandments from. I'm simply replying playing "devil's advocate" haha)
    December 10th, 2014 at 09:19pm
  • CallusedSilk

    CallusedSilk (100)

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    Edited by a moderator.
    December 10th, 2014 at 10:02pm
  • January Rose

    January Rose (100)

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    @ Brianna Marie
    Thank you for stating your opinion. I fully agree with everything g you said. :)
    December 10th, 2014 at 11:41pm
  • Alsoldey

    Alsoldey (230)

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    I am always torn about these kinds of questions and there are always going to be moments in life when I say "yes he is real"

    But as of now? I'm not sure.
    December 11th, 2014 at 12:33am
  • Teddi Manni

    Teddi Manni (100)

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    @ January Rose
    Awww <3 I'm so glad!!

    @ CallusedSilk
    A woman was property because men made them as such. Not God. My point was when I said we make each other objects now is because we still continue not to follow the Bible. Women back then were treated a lot better if they were under a godly household, mind you.

    To answer to the bear thing, you don't seem to understand that they were literally saying he was bald. It was a curse back then, it was a curse on God and his people. That's the way it was used back then. Again, translations are terrible.

    The funny thing is God didn't make us flawed. He simply made us. God wanted people to love Him as a Father. You can't love someone if it's forced; that's not what love is. He gave us free will and we abused that. We make choices to do crappy things. Not Him.

    About the raping, in Deuteronomy 22, it states that if a man rapes a women, he is to pay the father and marry her. That is to keep them pure and godly. Nowhere does it say that if she refuses to marry him then she is stoned. Also, in that book, it says that if a man rapes a women who is betrothed (in which she is already married) then the rapist is put to death.

    About stoning, if you look at the Bible you see that there are two testaments. An Old and a New. You are taking everything from the Old, so don't worry about God being awful because He sees everything and that things, situations, whathaveyou change over time. Back then, children were only stoned if the council examined their case for a while and found that they should be stoned. The council only examined them AFTER their parents continued to love and discipline them, but the child kept on doing that very wrong behavior.

    Regarding your bashing about me believing a book about "virgins and whores", I would love if you didn't generalize the Bible. Bath-sheba committed adultery, God later blessed her with a son after she repented and gave her life to God. A woman in Endor who practiced witchcraft nursed Saul back to health. This is significant because she is still regarded positively for showing such warmth towards Saul who was a God-fearing man. There was a widow of Zarephath and Zidon who struggled with starvation, but she gave her last bit of food to Elijah and cared for him since he was exiled. How awesome is this widow? Actually, I could go on about the women of the Bible but i won't because that hasn't much to do with your comment since it's about virgins and whores: meaning that a lot of the women in the Bible don't have mention about being a virgin or not.

    Jesus had died and saved us. So, those laws meant for one nation don't apply to the New Testament or today's society.

    Also, children weren't stoned for misbehaving. They had to be disciplined over and over again, then if the child still did the bad things he knows he is not supposed to do then a council was to oversee the child's case for a while before deciding if he should or should not be stoned. But again, Old Testament.

    I hope I got all your points <3

    Very Happy
    December 11th, 2014 at 12:39am
  • Teddi Manni

    Teddi Manni (100)

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    @ SmilingScarlet

    That's interesting. What makes you unsure?
    December 11th, 2014 at 12:40am
  • Alsoldey

    Alsoldey (230)

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    @ Brianna Marie
    Because of the 43 students in Mexico, what's happening in Ferguson, and what happened to the man who couldn't breathe and the cop that choked him to death--who was caught on video--and wasn't indicted.

    But that's all I'll say. Other than that I can't tell you why.
    December 11th, 2014 at 12:47am
  • Teddi Manni

    Teddi Manni (100)

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    @ SmilingScarlet
    Well, that would definitely not be God, but some terrible people with terrible values/morals/etc. in this world and in the police force. I read the choking ordeal of that man...that was absolutely horrendous. And it makes no sense how in the heck he didn't get indicted.

    It's actually times like these with all the stuff you stated, that I find we should love one another, show that there's a better life out there than the morbid, perverse one we all live now and showing how much God wants us to stop with this racism, violence, and hate towards one another so we can live for our eternity and not live only for the short life we have on this earth.
    December 11th, 2014 at 12:53am
  • CallusedSilk

    CallusedSilk (100)

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    Edited by a moderator.
    December 11th, 2014 at 06:00am
  • Teddi Manni

    Teddi Manni (100)

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    @ CallusedSilk
    I love how you are giving rational points and replying almost-free of condescension because it actually helps me create coherent thoughts and facts about what's in the Bible and why this stuff was happening. So thank you for letting me have this informative conversation with you. Please, don't read that as sarcasm because it was not meant to be, I genuinely mean it Hug

    In regards to Jesus Christ, you are entirely right about His Son not eradicating laws. But he came down to take the place of all of our sins and make a new covenant which was prophesied in the Old Testament book Jeremiah and was later said it was fulfilled by Jesus in Matthew. It wasn't to do away with the law because the law says not to do certain things because they are evil, but it was to forgive those evils even if you have done them already, so that you may live a heavenly, loving life with God in heaven.

    Speaking of sin and heaven: Because Jesus did not die for the sins of all in the Old Testament, doing evil or not being pure means you can't go to heaven and be with God. As a father, God wants all His children to be with Him in heaven. So he placed those laws to keep people pure. And you're forgetting that these are merely laws and that there's no mention of them being broken. The laws themselves made the people do good and not evil; that way, they can be with Him in heaven. It wasn't to make the woman miserable if she were raped, it was to keep her pure because God loved her and her eternal life of love means more than anything that happens in the short life on earth. That is when God realized that because people are born sinful people because of our free will, it's simply in our nature, and will eventually do some sort of evil/sin, He brought Jesus Christ down to cover it all. Also, since Jesus and God have forgive all our sin and has covered it all with the price of pure untainted blood, the new law says not to do these sins, but those who do we need to be kind to them 92 Timothy 2:224-25) and to show them love (1 Cor. 16:14; 2 Cor. 5:14). Because killing them will do nothing as the Old Testament required since they are already forgiven and have their chance to ascend to heaven and live in eternal love and joy despite their wrongdoings. In Hebrews 9:15: "For this reason Christ is the mediator of a new covenant, that those who are called may receive the promised eternal inheritance—now that He has died as a ransom to set them free from the sins committed under the first covenant.”

    All in all, God doesn't enjoy punishing people, but it had to be done to keep those pure so they can be with Him. That's all God wants, as many of His children to come to Him and be with Him and heaven. So, he truly did do something about the harsh laws of the way back when because He didn't like the punishments and wanted more children to be with Him in heaven.

    So yes, the law was harsh, but if you take a moment to understand that one's spirit cannot go to heaven when it is wicked and impure, then you'll understand why God did whatever He could to keep His children pure so they can be in Heaven. By stoning someone or punishing them in that harsh way had to be done in order to keep them pure. So, if a girl was raped, but didn't want to live her days with her rapist, she could say no, be put to death but her spirit be pure still because it already took its punishment for that crime and go to heaven and be with God.

    Because back then, there was no Son to cover our wicked souls and make them clean, to make them pure again, they had to be punished. But in the end, they live a perfect and loving eternal life with God.

    That's all God wants: us in Heaven, not suffering in Hell.

    I haven't picked up my Bible in awhile and haven't given the Old Testament much thought. But since you have come up with logical, great points, I have picked it up and read it, understanding God and the Bible moreso now than ever before. So I thank you for getting me started again, and I thank God for getting me out of the worry I had when I first read what you posted to that girl about how He has done these wicked, cruel things. I believed you, and I understand that thinking.

    Because I was so distraught, I prayed to God whom I haven't really spoken with in over a year for whatever reason. I asked Him to give me the truth, and nothing but the truth. After reading and studying the Bible, God has shown me this, that He loves His children and He sees their future. He cares whether they go to Heaven or Hell, so He puts in law and gave His Son so we have the choice not to go to hell. Thank you!
    December 11th, 2014 at 03:36pm