Pornography

Porn is boring, and it's not like real sex...except I suppose that's why people like it. O_o

^It's definitely why people like it.

And all the posts degrading rough/rape/molestation-esque porn... most of the time, it's not reality. Why on earth would rapists STAGE a porn video, creating evidence against them, and then post it on the internet? It's a ridiculous assumption to make, that all rape-porn is real. That's like saying all furry porn is by people who are furries, or that all gang-bang porn is with men/women who do that in their day to day life.
It's their job, and they (most of the time) have a choice.

Also, if someone enjoys watching porn, regardless of the type, it's rather offensive to say "If you come home from high school and watch a bunch of gangbang-internet-porn, you could have a problem," IMHO.
I wonder what you think of people in a healthy sub/dom relationship?

his princess:

It's just another movie genre children shouldn't be a part of in anyway. If you're older (not like, 30, but not my age) and you and your signifigant other want to watch it and then have sex, it's normal. If you come home from high school and watch a bunch of gangbang-internet-porn, you could have a problem.

If someone had a significant other (that they have sexual relations with, anyways) they wouldn't really want to watch porn... but rather act it out in the sheets Haha, but being serious now... it doesn't seem fair that only people in a committed relationship can watch porn. Most people wouldn't really like finding out that their boyfriend/girlfriend/wife/husband/fiance/whatever was watching porn, anyways...

And I thought that last comment was pretty offensive, and I don't even watch porn... some people get turned on by acting out these types of situations with their significant other. Does not mean that they have a problem.

In a month, my school is having their annual debate. This year it's about pornography. Ron Jeremy will be arguing the pro side, and Craig Gross, founder of XXX Church to argue the con. I think it will be really interesting. I think the debate will mainly focus on social issues rather than legal which I'm glad. That will be more interesting than "this should/shouldn't" be legal for two hours.

^Actual Ron Jeremy is coming to your school? :|

Xsoteria:

^Actual Ron Jeremy is coming to your school? :|

Yeah, I guess he does a lot of public speaking now. An odd shift in career to say the least

http://www.wolfmanproductions.com/porn.html
That's kind of the speil his agent sent.

acorna:

And all the posts degrading rough/rape/molestation-esque porn... most of the time, it's not reality. Why on earth would rapists STAGE a porn video, creating evidence against them, and then post it on the internet? It's a ridiculous assumption to make, that all rape-porn is real. That's like saying all furry porn is by people who are furries, or that all gang-bang porn is with men/women who do that in their day to day life.
It's their job, and they (most of the time) have a choice.

And this is backed up by anything except anecdotal evidence? There are about one million different child pornography material flying around the Internet and about 29% of it (source) is hardcore violence. Needless to say all child porn is reality, 10 year olds do get raped and then pictures or video recordings of it do get posted online. I don't understand why it's so hard to believe that the same thing can happen when adults are involved.

75% of guys look it up. It shouldn't be such a fuss.

But I like porn :D

Helps with people questioning their sexuality!

^I agree with that, it helped a few of my friends figure out their sexuality.

Mr W. H.:

And this is backed up by anything except anecdotal evidence? There are about one million different child pornography material flying around the Internet and about 29% of it (source) is hardcore violence. Needless to say all child porn is reality, 10 year olds do get raped and then pictures or video recordings of it do get posted online. I don't understand why it's so hard to believe that the same thing can happen when adults are involved.

I'm not sure she said all of it is fake. Just that there's no reason to believe it's all real, or the majority of it for that matter.

Xsoteria:

I'm not sure she said all of it is fake. Just that there's no reason to believe it's all real, or the majority of it for that matter.

But how do you know that what you're buying/downloading is fake and not somebody actually getting raped? I don't understand how somebody could live with the thought that they might be watching somebody getting raped and drawing enjoyment out of it. And I mean, even if they are fake, we're basically endorsing in and glamorizing the degradation of other human beings - violent porn actually says 'look how sexy/fun/amazing rape is', that's just something our society should not endorse. It's like marketing footage of Nazi camps as something fun, exciting to watch. It's just wrong on so many levels.

I'm not going to go into how or why people enjoy violent porn. But the fact alone that it's a supposed rape and it's being advertised or sold on a porn site that's not instantly shut down by the authorities, should tell you how credible the actual rape is.

Also I don't think the glorification part works that way. It's not like people are going to think rape is awesome after watching a violent porn, if they haven't thought so before.

Why do people watch porn if not for enjoyment then? Is porn a sophisticated form of art that only a selected few can understand?
I think violent porn is illegal in several countries actually.

Mr W. H.:

But how do you know that what you're buying/downloading is fake and not somebody actually getting raped? I don't understand how somebody could live with the thought that they might be watching somebody getting raped and drawing enjoyment out of it. And I mean, even if they are fake, we're basically endorsing in and glamorizing the degradation of other human beings - violent porn actually says 'look how sexy/fun/amazing rape is', that's just something our society should not endorse. It's like marketing footage of Nazi camps as something fun, exciting to watch. It's just wrong on so many levels.

There are people out there with weird fetishes. Rape is one.

Re: rape and porn. I don't disagree that the idea of 'rape' is a common paraphilia, but rape and pornography, when intertwined whether it be fake or real, is problematic.

Mr. W. H's claim about whether or not you can tell if rape porn is 'real' is a sensible one. Just like how you probably couldn't tell whether a porn star was paid or not, or whether he/she signed an actual contract beforehand. Even if they are 'well known' porn companies or sites, there is not actual way - as a consumer - to know the source of it, and the production means, or how they treat their actors off camera.

There is some porn that is still highly stylised and thought-out shot to shot, but then there are also ones that just have a camera running the whole time and there's room for spontaneity. Sometimes, like with IRL sex, it may be hard for the woman to explicitly say 'no' to something, and this may especially be the case if money is involved. She may feel like she cannot say no to anything once the camera's on because she signed a contract and if she pulls out she might not get paid.

It's more complex than people think. Rape fantasy IRL is one thing, but when it goes through a medium such as film and the consumer is passively watching without any knowledge of the production or treatment of the talent and the production, then it can get REALLY murky and it is not so cut and dried, and consent is not always implied or obvious.

I remember when I was about 10 my older cousin showed me a porn image on the computer. Talk about fucking disturbed? I think it's ok, as long as it doesn't get into the wrong hands...

Mr W. H.:

Why do people watch porn if not for enjoyment then? Is porn a sophisticated form of art that only a selected few can understand?
I think violent porn is illegal in several countries actually.

I'm not sure how this post translates into what we were saying earlier?

People get off on violent porn. I suppose there may be a random person out there who idk, collects it for artistic value but that doesn't have anything to do with whether or not the rape on film is real, or whether or not the majority of it is staged or not.

veronika:

Re: rape and porn. I don't disagree that the idea of 'rape' is a common paraphilia, but rape and pornography, when intertwined whether it be fake or real, is problematic.

Mr. W. H's claim about whether or not you can tell if rape porn is 'real' is a sensible one. Just like how you probably couldn't tell whether a porn star was paid or not, or whether he/she signed an actual contract beforehand. Even if they are 'well known' porn companies or sites, there is not actual way - as a consumer - to know the source of it, and the production means, or how they treat their actors off camera.

There is some porn that is still highly stylised and thought-out shot to shot, but then there are also ones that just have a camera running the whole time and there's room for spontaneity. Sometimes, like with IRL sex, it may be hard for the woman to explicitly say 'no' to something, and this may especially be the case if money is involved. She may feel like she cannot say no to anything once the camera's on because she signed a contract and if she pulls out she might not get paid.

It's more complex than people think. Rape fantasy IRL is one thing, but when it goes through a medium such as film and the consumer is passively watching without any knowledge of the production or treatment of the talent and the production, then it can get REALLY murky and it is not so cut and dried, and consent is not always implied or obvious.

But that goes for all porn. We can't tell if women consented or were in it because they desperately needed money. The issue here was if it's real or not (the majority of it anyway). I don't think it is. I'm sure there is real rape porn out there but I don't think there's a reason to assume all of it is such.

For the user of the film in particular, it's only relevant if it's real or not if he's paying for it, therefore if he's supporting some rapists or some porn developers. The difference between real rape porn and fake one is huge, and I wouldn't exactly put them together in the same category of "problematic".

Xsoteria:

But that goes for all porn. We can't tell if women consented or were in it because they desperately needed money. The issue here was if it's real or not (the majority of it anyway). I don't think it is. I'm sure there is real rape porn out there but I don't think there's a reason to assume all of it is such.

For the user of the film in particular, it's only relevant if it's real or not if he's paying for it, therefore if he's supporting some rapists or some porn developers. The difference between real rape porn and fake one is huge, and I wouldn't exactly put them together in the same category of "problematic".

I never assumed all rape porn was real. I was just suggesting that personal discretion is probably wise and that no one really knows if it was consensual.

How do you know the difference? Have you watched a real rape video and the compared it with a fake one? Rape does not have to be overly violent to be rape.

What I am saying is problematic is not necessarily the people watching it (they may be none the wiser), but the people out there who rape people and film it and then pass it off as pornography.

You can't pretend it's not a murky area - the fact the we don't know if some random porn video was consensual is dodgy in itself. That's the main problem I think is relevant to the internet porn industry. There's so much shit out there that it can be hard for the user to tell, and one could unwittingly be watching rape, or non-consensual sex, or sex where one or both of the people don't know they're being filmed etc.

^I suppose you're right in a sense that the user sometimes can't tell if the actual film was consentual or not, but I still don't think that actual rapes stay on public porn sites for long. For starters, it's direct incriminating evidence against the rapist and in general shouldn't be in his interest to be accessible by everyone, site that hosts violent porn usually knows the consequences of having illegal videos on their domain, and therefore tries their best to publish videos they know are not real, there are a bunch of "public decency" internet groups scouring for just such material on the web, taking down real videos and those who publish it in the process and finally, the users themselves will often try and poke out the history behind a suspicious video to try and determine its authenticity, and once that information is acquired it spreads out pretty fast and there's always at least one person who has their conscience burdened and reports it.

Of course, I imagine if you dig deeper into Web, you'll find some real rapes, but they're not part of porn industry nor are they easily accessible by the public.